Peter Capaldi has spoken to NME about his second solo album ‘Sweet Illusions’, the state of UK politics, his upcoming role in Black Mirror, mental health support in the film and TV industry, the Oasis reunion and the success of his second cousin once removed, Lewis Capaldi.
The 66-year-old actor, who is renowned for playing the main role in Doctor Who and the profane spin doctor Malcolm Tucker in the political satire The Thick of It, was speaking to NME at a junket for the upcoming second series of supernatural psychological thriller The Devil’s Hour.
His punk and new wave-influenced ‘Sweet Illusions’ follows 2021’s ‘St. Christopher’ and has been preceded by atmospheric lead single ‘Bin Night’. The album will be released via the independent label Last Night From Glasgow and was produced by Dr. Robert of The Blow Monkeys. Capaldi described his musical side project as “one of the great freedoms”.
“What thrills me about it is that it’s mine, so I don’t have to sell it in any particular way,” Capaldi told NME. “I have deliberately gone with a record company that’s not a bigger record company. I don’t want any obligations. I don’t have anyone saying, ‘You’ve got to go on The One Show.’ This is about my exploration of myself, artistically – and fun! If it’s not fun, I’m not doing it.”
Capaldi praised his friend and Last Night From Glasgow labelmate Dr. Robert’s virtuosity and encouragement. “I’ve never been the guy at the party with a guitar,” he admitted. “I’d love to be, but I’ve never been that guy.”
Check out the full interview below, where he told us about The Devil’s Hour, how UK politics is too “bleak” to satirise, teased his upcoming role in ‘Black Mirror’, praised his cousin Lewis Capaldi and described mental health support in film and TV as “amusing” but welcome.
Peter Capaldi: “Terrible name!” [Laughs]
… You told him that no one had heard of the group because, although you were the frontman, “I can’t sing and I’m not musical”. What changed?
“I enjoyed doing it and I work at it, so I’m trying to find my way through it. When I was working with Craig in the Dreamboys, it was in that punk sort of vibe, just having a go. Glasgow, at the time, was a very vibrant place. Well, it always is, musically. But you had a lot of great bands like Simple Minds, so it was a place where you could get gigs. You could go and play, even if you weren’t very good. And I think we were better than I thought, but I’m always very critical.”
How would you describe ‘Sweet Illusions’?
“I’m always trying to discover for myself who I am, musically – without being too grand about it. You know, I am light-hearted about it, but I do take it seriously and try my best. The whole thing has quite a nostalgic feeling about it, but the nostalgia is probably for that period because I’m picking up where I left off. It’s a bit art studenty, Glasgow, 1978, rainy… but I’m plugging it with synthesisers and fat guitars.”
The track ‘The Big Guy’ has some very thought-provoking lyrics…
“It’s about someone who’s losing themselves. If you know anybody who’s had Alzheimer’s or any disease like that, the question is always: ‘I know you… Do you know me?’ So that song is about somebody going to visit someone who is slipping. That’s what’s going on… I think.
“The thing about songs is that you don’t know. I’ve been involved in a lot of scriptwriting and that has an absolute tyranny of logic to it. Scriptwriting has to be this story and the bits have to all make sense. Songwriting can be about many different things and the logic in it is more fluid and less readable. If that song is about anything, it’s about coming face-to-face with somebody who is gone, and you wish they weren’t gone.”
On ‘Through the Cracks’, you sing: “You can fuck Good Morning Britain / And all the papers too.” Is that a true reflection of your feelings about the current state of… things?
“It has to be said that a lot of these songs are about characters, so there are people who are not necessarily me. I’ve never been a fan of shows like that. I never felt comfortable on them. Although I always like to see Lorraine [Kelly]. She’s lovely and I enjoy being on her show. I think [that lyric] is really an expression of how all that stuff rots people’s brains. It’s not necessarily deliberate, but it holds people back because it presents a very simplistic picture of the world. I don’t enjoy that.”
You don’t tend to give Malcom Tucker’s takes on current affairs anymore…
“People often ask me to do that on family shows. I have to say: ‘Well, if you seriously want me to say that… I can’t!’ Malcolm’s a survivor. I think he has very clear opinions about what’s going on. But it’s all so shitty. It’s all so disappointing and bleak. You know, Malcolm’s essentially a comic character and one of the reasons we’ve resisted a return is that politics is so depressing at the moment that I don’t want to let them off the hook by making fun of them.”
So you agree with The Thick of It creator Armando Iannucci, who famously said that politics has become too ridiculous to satirise?
“I think that’s it. And also politics is just exhausting. People always ask me about politics, and I’m only interested in politics because I have to be. I don’t mean professionally; I mean just because the walls are coming in and we have to fight back in some way. That’s my only interest: trying to make things better.”
Your cousin Lewis Capaldi is on hiatus to focus on his health. For all its flaws, the music industry has made progress in terms of looking after artists in this respect. What’s the equivalent situation in film and TV?
“You’ll see a little note on the call sheet that says: ‘If any of the events that you are depicting have a negative resonance for you, please call this number.’ And there’s a growing industry of psychiatric support for actors. It’s good because I think people need help, but it’s a little mysterious to me because it’s all pretend anyway. If you’re upset by this pretence – well, you probably do need some to talk you through it, so it’s good that there are people there. I slightly worry that some actors who are perhaps a little more self-obsessed would enjoy the attention of illuminating their struggle.
“But there is more support and I think that’s right, particularly about making these environments safer for people – for women in particular. They’ve always been a little rough-and-ready, because that’s the nature of the business: you’re always trying to deliver this thing and there’s a ticking clock, so you’ve got to try and get it done by six O’clock and everybody is focused on that. So sometimes the process of making it can be a little unpoliced. I think it’s good for people to feel safe. I’m totally up for that.
“I do laugh at it slightly because I’m a man of a certain age. I was born in 1958. That’s only 13 years after the Second World War! I come for a whole different generation, so the world seems strange. Trying to make those work environments safer and better seems to be coming from a good place – but it is amusing. But you’re sort of not allowed to say it’s amusing. I guess that’s the trouble. The safest alternative is to shut up, which is a shame, really. But it’s right that things are changing.”
Any chance of you and Lewis collaborating musically?
“I don’t know – I don’t really know Lewis. I think he’s fabulous. Before he was famous, I went to see him because I had discovered that he was doing stuff. And it was amazing. It wasn’t a big gig, but it was packed and everyone knew all the words to his songs. I was so proud of him. We met up afterward and he was just fabulous. So funny. And then he asked me to be in the video for ‘Someone You Loved’. I just look at him and go: ‘There’s so much talent there.’
“But the speed of [his ascent]… When I knew him, he was playing bars and stuff like that. And then within a year, he was at the Emmys. I mean, that’s a lot. But he’s brilliant, so he’ll be back. He’s the real thing. It’s in his heart and it’s in his soul and it’s in his songs. It’ll all come out in that, which is why he’s the real thing. His music is a natural expression of who he is.”
You’re an Oasis fan. What have you made of their reunion?
“I was surprised and delighted by it. I love their music. I wasn’t there at the start because of the age I am. By that time, I was taking kids to school. I only really got into them about 10 years ago, so it was all kind of new to me. But I love all those fat guitars. The songs are sadder and more melancholic than they appear. They appear to be this bludgeoning kind of thing, this thing that gets people charged up, but you actually listen to a song like ‘Let There Be Love’ and when the two of them are singing, you go: ‘Well, actually, that’s really sad.”
“The story arc of the two brothers who split…. You see that documentary Liam made after the band split [2013’s Start Anew? A Film About Liam Gallagher And Beady Eye] and he’s getting this new band together and being a tough guy and all that – you can see his heart’s absolutely broken. So this is a kind of elemental story, bringing them back together, hopefully for good. Now, this might all just be fantasy and might it all just be money. I don’t know. I don’t care, really. I like them a lot.”
[To no-one in particular] “Are we allowed to say anything about that? I’m at an age now where every time I do a job there’s a younger version of me! There’s always a scene where the older version talks about the younger version, and then we go back and see the younger version. There is an older version of me and a younger version, and we get embroiled with that in a digital…
“I don’t know if I’m allowed to say! I don’t care; I’m always given these lists of things you can’t say. And I always go, ‘Well, why are we talking about this in the first place, then?’ But because [this junket] isn’t about [Black Mirror], I haven’t been given a list.”
“I think that was quite nice, yeah. It’s a surprise, because I never thought of myself that way. When I started up when I was young, I played easygoing, youthful, geeky, kind of warm characters. But somewhere along the line – probably around The Thick Of It and Malcolm Tucker – I began to change and develop a more sinister vibe. I just got older, really, and got more complicated, I suppose.
“I used to do voiceovers for Anchor Butter. [Adopts warm voice] ‘Anchor Butter: tastes like home.’ It was that kind of thing. But then one day I went in for what I was to discover was my last voiceover for them and they said: ‘Could you try to sound a little less… sinister?’ [Laughs] Obviously my voice had shifted into a more sinister range. So I don’t mind that. I think that’s a pretty good compliment. I don’t do it on purpose. It’s not a talent, but if I’m found to be scary, that’s a useful thing.”
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